Japanese rule playing Base-Neo

Hello,I’m Japanese.
Japanese player use this list playing Base-Neo.
Player must make a deck less than eight point.
Because a few card in Base-Neo is too strong.
I want Overseas friends to know this rule.
This rule make the game interesting.
Sorry for my poor English.

I mistook.
Correctly,less than nine point.

Hi good idea

Hi I’m glad you said that.

Some of the cards have blue and red borders around them, does this signify anything specific?

Hi, I would love to know more about why some cards have blue and red around them if you can explain. Thanks! Very interested in this format.

Hi,sorry for the late reply.

This format has been updated on the result of the tournament every year.

Red has risen,blue has dropped.

Sorry for the late reply.
It is official rule.
But this is funmade rule.
Current,japanese player play funmade rule.
Because,funmade rule is better than official rule.

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Late reply but another question I forgot to ask - If you pay the points for a card, is it to run one copy or the ability to run a full playset?


Why is the Vending Omanyte worthy of six stars? Seems like a fairly average card

Going by Watermelon’s site (http://blog.livedoor.jp/aqwsderft/archives/46700055.html), it seems someone created a surprisingly effective Donphan deck which uses this Omanyte. Donphan uses rapid spin, making a Mysterious Fossil your new active Pokemon. If your opponent knocks out Mysterious Fossil, he doesn’t draw a prize - and thanks to Omanyte, you never run out of Mysterious Fossils…

This seems like a really fun way to play that solves many of the problems with the format. I would so be down to get a group of players playing this way.


@nobu, I know these lists are changed regularly. Do you have the most updated version?

Japan has three different Hall of Fame formats for Base-Neo, as explained in this article. OP posted the list for the Suginami 2020 format. I’ve attached the first part of the Suginami list for 2022, which I found here.

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And here’s the second part. Sorry for the double post - new forum users can only attach one image per post.

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This looks like an interesting format!
I’ve checked out Watermelon’s blog, and it looks like it has a good database that ranks all the cards legal in the Hall of Fame format, although it would seem that the blog is taking all “old back formats” into account when ranking cards. I’ve read the first page, and was not surprised to see Blastoise’s high rank, considering how it got limited to Three Points. Also not surprisingly, Blastoise had by far the longest list of references, including two Hall of Fame articles.


I am curious about one thing, though. Is there a website with a list of successful deck lists from the Hall of Fame format (like ptcgarchive), a more professional list of viable deck lists with brief strategy help (like Jason Klaczynski’s blog), a tier list (ranking list?) for successful decks, or even a set of detailed tournament reports which I could examine? I can keep looking for resources myself, but if anyone has already searched through the online resources for the Hall of Fame format, your help would be greatly appreciated.
By the way, I’ve also been looking at the cards in the two lists above and studying their prices on TCGPLAYER (the main American online store specializing in Pokémon cards), and it looks like the Trainer cards will still probably cost $40 dollars (minus Erika, which costs $4 in Moderately Played condition on TCGPLAYER, but which has a cheap Supporter reprint from Cosmic Eclipse). However, not having to buy an entire playset of expensive “staples” (top cards), such as Computer Search, Item Finder, Blastoise, or Wigglytuff, will make it possible to build many top decks for $80. This happens to be a common deck cost for Prop 15/3, America’s attempt to restrict powerful cards. You can read about it below:

Note: In my deck cost estimate, I looked at Moderately Played card prices for several cards, and I also didn’t calculate shipping for
(Note that I am considering Moderately Played copies and only giving a narrow margin to potential shipping fees when I made this estimate. For a more accurate estimate, you could use TCGPLAYER’s Cart Optimizer. https://cart.tcgplayer.com/shoppingcart)
Also, about playing this format on TCGONE. Couldn’t we just make a forum thread where people who are interested in the format can plan games and post their deck lists? (A Discord channel would also work, but I stopped using Discord a year ago because it was too distracting, so at that point I wouldn’t be able to see who is interested in playing.)
P.S. @JasonKlaczynski I know you have a lot of ideas for your blog (which I will not divulge here in case you didn’t want to share them with the public), but does the Hall of Fame format seem like a format you might consider writing about some time in the distant future? It looks interesting. I’m sure there would be more incentive to document it if it becomes a supported format on TCGONE.

Well, in the eight hours since I made that previous post, I have, in fact, actually read through the entire database (though perhaps not very thoroughly). It was nice to see Life Drain (Sabrina’s Kadabra) is viable again, as it’s one of my favorite Prop 15/3 decks. Venusaur/Meganium looks like fun deck, but unfortunately buying two Moderately Played Meganium would cost about $45 (excluding tax). Although I had already resigned myself to using proxies for Blaine’s Charizard, another of my favorite Prop 15/3 decks. (In case you’re wondering, I’ve mentioned all my favorite Prop 15/3 decks at some point in the conversation). If people start playing this on TCGONE, I’ll probably try playing Rain Dance again, and I might try using Dark Fearow (Japanese exclusive) or Shining Raichu. I still don’t have a very good idea of what the meta would look like, but that probably won’t matter if nobody else does and only a handful of people are playing.
Anyone in favor of playing Hall of Fame? It seems like many people were interested, but I have yet to see any evidence of players taking the next step and organizing games. @nobu, I’m guessing you would like to play a game some time, since you started this thread?

Well, I realized a few more things. First, I realized this thread is two years and five months old, and the last past was a four months and three weeks ago, last year. I’m surprised this thread amassed seven votes and fourteen replies without anyone actually trying to play the format.

Second, that Dark Fearow I was looking at earlier costs around $100 in the United States. (how many Yen does it cost in Japan? People don’t actually pay 13,000 yen for Bad Onidrill, do they?) Somehow this deck costs even more to build than Blaine’s Charizard/Blaine’s Rapidash from Prop 15/3, since you can actually find Moderately Played Blaine’s Charizard for $40 on ebay, if you’re patient.
On a similar note, I still believe you could build a good deck for less than $100, but I didn’t realize how many $20 cards there are in this format. I really am curious how much the Vending Promos cost in Japan, because I have a hard time believing Chansey from expansion sheet 1 costs 2,668 yen. Also, any evolving basic not released internationally is going to raise your deck’s cost by about $5 to $10 if you’re buying these cards off of ebay. I would really like to know how much all these cards would cost if I walked into a card shop in Japan.
Also, the format whose list was posted above, the Suginami format, it being discontinued. The Suginami 2022 format was the list Suginami format. While this is convenient for international players, since we won’t have to keep track of changes to the list, it means it will be harder to find Japanese players to play the format with. The Takatsuki Hall of Fame also seems to be popular, but in addition to banning the cards excluded from official competitive play (sad bird noises), it has some custom rules. It’s probably easier to stick to Suginami for now. Not that there’s anyone to discuss the other formats with at the moment.

Finally, there are some interesting looking cards on the list that were never added to TCGONE because they were never legal in official tournaments. While ___'s Pikachu and Imakuni’s Doduo are natural exclusions, Dark Fearow, Great Rocket’s Mewtwo, and ___'s Chansey (yes, I verified that it’s attack doesn’t reference your birthday before posting) are all interesting looking cards. Great Rocket’s Mewtwo is the only one that would concern me if it was added to ordinary Base-Neo. Fortunately, I can still make an optimal Shining Raichu deck, if anyone wants to play.
Do you think people would be willing to play if I published some Hall of Fame decklists on the Quickplay Decks page?
Here is the link to the database I’ve been exploring. It was posted already, but this way you won’t have to dig around for it.

Edit: I just completed and publicized a Shining Raichu list which you can access in Quickplay. I started with this one–
–and then checked it against the points list. Scoop Up is worth one point each in Suginami, so I had to cut 2 copies, adding a fourth Super Scoop Up to compensate. Lass was also unfeasible, since it’s now worth four points, so I removed both copies. I guess at some point I replaced one Sabrina’s Gaze for a second Water Energy. This left four slots, so I added a Slowpoke, Slowbro, and two Defender, which I thought was a fun package. I’m not sure if I will ever get a chance to play this deck, but it looks fun. It reminds me of the Lightning spread deck Jason Klaczynksi has been testing for Prop 15/3.

EDIT: (3/16/2023)
Apparently I can’t post more than 3 consecutive replies. I’m not quite familiar with this forum yet. I desperately need to take a break from fixating on this topic. If someone else wants to carry the ball, that would be great.
My investigations continue.
Perhaps the clearest format summary I’ve found so far was for a different Hall of Fame format, “New Hall of Fame.”
Seeing those deck lists ranked was certainly nice, but this format seems to be much looser on its points restriction system. Take the Shining Raichu list, for instance. It runs 1 Shining Raichu, 2 Electrode, 4 Scoop Up, and 2 Lass. By the 2022 Suginami points list, that’s 18 points worth of cards. (Yikes. And the author seems to treat it as the BDIF. No wonder it got restricted.)
I have yet to find a Suginami Hall of Fame article of similar quality. At some point we’re going to need to settle on a format. I’d personally choose Suginami or Takatsuki, but Suginami is discontinued and Takatsuki requires you not to draw a card at the beginning of your turn (which is the only difference from standard “Wizards of the Coast”/“Old Back” (American/Japanese) rules). I’m currently translating this article–
–because it seems to be the only page of Watermelon’s blog that doesn’t get translated automatically. I don’t know Japanese, I’m just plugging each paragraph (or group of short paragraphs) into Google Translate and then pasting it into a Google Document. I’m not sure why Google won’t let me directly translate this page. I clicked the box for “translate Japanese automatically” after reading a few articles, but I don’t see that option either.
Here is my limitless decklist image for the Shining Raichu list I posted on Quickplay decks. The Base Set Voltorb are stand-ins for the vending series Voltorb, and the Fossil Ditto is a stand-in for vending series Ditto.
I’ve also included the Limitless format text decklist.


1 Shining Raichu 111 N4
2 Electrode 21 BS
3 Voltorb 67 BS
1 Slowbro 43 FO
1 Slowpoke 73 N1
3 Ditto 18 FO
2 Unown 67 N2
1 Rattata 66 TR
4 Professor Oak 88 BS
4 Erika 16 G1
4 Bill 91 BS
4 Mary 87 N1
3 Bill’s Teleporter 91 N1
1 Sabrina’s Gaze 125 G1
4 Good Manners 111 G1
2 Pokémon Trader 77 BS
1 Here Comes Team Rocket! 71 TR
1 Imposter Professor Oak 73 BS
3 Recycle 61 FO
4 Super Scoop Up 98 N1
2 Scoop Up 78 BS
2 Defender 80 BS
1 PlusPower 84 BS
1 Goop Gas Attack 78 TR
1 Warp Point 126 G2
1 Miracle Berry 94 N1
1 Resistance Gym 109 G2
2 Water Energy 130 BS2

As far as prices go, I’m realizing more and more that $80 decks are the exception, not the rule. Dark Crobat and vending Ditto are ubiquitous enough to find their way into many decks, and vending series evolving basics will be expensive unless you live in Japan. Shining Raichu being uneconomical comes as no surprise to those familiar with the price of Shining Pokémon.
I probably need to stop thinking about this format for a while. These speculations and this research is taking up far too much of my time and my thoughts. I’ll probably come back to this topic at some point, but I need a break. Feel free to explore the wealth of resources linked on this thread.

This format looks super interesting. Might have to try converting my Dark Gengar deck over.

I’d love to try playing this! @Charmaster @tides